Starkey: Steelers could use a slice of reality

OX1947 wrote:

W's and L's is all that matters in sports.

Art II doesn't agree with you.

26 wins, and a conference title for Ben/Arians in their final two seasons together.

Arians got fired, and Art II told Ben to change.

Why?

ESPN Steelers man Jeremy Fowler:  

"Sobering stat on Steelers offense: No wide receiver not named Antonio Brown has more than 20 catches on the season."

And that's what happens when the pieces keep changing.  That's what happens when AB is the only constant WR on the field. All this dope does is recite stats, I would bet he doesn't pay attention to what happens ON the field.  

We play the Pats** with Landry Jones but playmakers Sammie Coates and Eli Rogers get a COMBINED 7 snaps.

MrFootball wrote:

So if not Tomlin?  WHO?  

Because if Art II fires Tomlin?  It's going to be Haley.  

There isnt anyone. That's the worst thing about all this. Nick Saban pops in my head every now and then, I dont know why. Maybe after he passes Bear Bryant in titles, he would want to give the NFL a shot. I still say had Miami picked Brees instead of Culpepper 10 years ago, Nick would still be the Miami Dolphins coach right now. Nick Saban is belichickesque and as long as you have Big Ben playing, and a great coach, you will win games and win the ones you are suppose to win.

Tomlin won 55 games, 2 conference titles, and a ring in 5 years and Art II overruled him.  

Coaching doesn't matter when your owner meddles and hires his friends.

Nick Saban would have laughed at Art Rooney II if he had the same record Tomlin did after 2011 and then told his QB to change how he plays.

MrFootball wrote:

OX1947 wrote:

W's and L's is all that matters in sports.

Art II doesn't agree with you.  

26 wins, and a conference title for Ben/Arians in their final two seasons together.  

Arians got fired, and Art II told Ben to change.  

Why?

And that is why I keep telling everyone blaming coordinators is not the issue. Arians went on to become a coach of the year. Arians was not the problem. I never believed he was. We were made to think he was. Head Coach runs the football team, not the position coaches or assistant coaches.

Over the last 7 years I have watched, on the average, the Steeler lose 2 games, each season to teams that have no business being in the same stadium. If you want me to run the teams in each season, i will. And those 2 loses are 1/8 of the season that gets flushed down the crapper each and every year. That is a huge number. One game last year for the broncos meant so much so they could get home field and it won them a super bowl. I remember in 2004 when the Pats* and colts played in week 1, the colts lost a game at home that eventually cost them home field and they got waxed in the AFC title game in New England. Now if Indy wins that game, they go 13-3 and Pats* go 13-3 and indy wins the tie breakers. AFC title game in Indy, not NE.

Football wins are so important week in and week out, it's not something you take lightly. Bill Cowher got some flake for not being a big game coach. However, he won the games he was suppose to win with execption to a few here and there. And he had to deal with the Neil O'donnell's and Kordell's and tommy maddox's of the world to get over those humps. It wasnt an accident that Bill's final 3 seasons with a Franchise QB(3rd year was the famous face to windshield off season) that he went 35-13, 2 afc title appearances and a super bowl win. And big wins on the road. Monumental wins on the road. One of the best coaching jobs i had seen in that indy game until the refs decided to fuck it up and almost cost them the game.

I have watched enough football to not be the typical Monday morning quarterback. I know good coaching when i see it and I have not been comfortable with Tomlin for a long time. And a lot of people tell themselves he is good when he isnt. He is an average coach with an organization that has a great system from drafting to culture. Who have a potential hall of fame QB that covers a lot of holes. Unfortunately, holes eventually crack if they aren't solid from a prep standpoint.

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And that is why I keep telling everyone blaming coordinators is not the issue. Arians went on to become a coach of the year. Arians was not the problem. I never believed he was. We were made to think he was. Head Coach runs the football team, not the position coaches or assistant coaches.

Tomlin wanted Arians back.  

Art II didn't let him.  

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However, he won the games he was suppose to win with execption to a few here and there.

Excuse me?  Cowher lost to THREE DIFFERENT EXPANSION TEAMS in year 1 of their program.  

Cowher also lost, to the 3-13 Bengals twice, they were 1-13 against the rest of the league.  

That's just off the top of my head.  There are more.  

He wanted Kordell.  Hell he gave Kordell more respect in regards to his 1998 OC search than Art II gives Ben now despite winning two rings.    

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It wasnt an accident that Bill's final 3 seasons with a Franchise QB(3rd year was the famous face to windshield off season) that he went 35-13, 2 afc title appearances and a super bowl win

With the QB he didn't want, nor did he want to play him in 2004.  BILL'S PLAN was for Ben to sit for a year or two behind Maddox, then play.  Cowher wanted Rivers, and then when he was gone he wanted Shawn Andrews.  Dan Rooney had to "remind" the staff that they passed on Marino 20 years earlier, then Ben was drafted.  

Go watch Cowher after Ben was selected in his interview during the 2004 draft.  He looks like someone told him his dog died.

MrFootball wrote:

OX1947 wrote:

W's and L's is all that matters in sports.

Art II doesn't agree with you.  

26 wins, and a conference title for Ben/Arians in their final two seasons together.  

Arians got fired, and Art II told Ben to change.  

Why?

Because Ben was getting the crap kicked out of him and going forward the team was not going to be able to rely on a perennial #1 defense?

Ben's alarming sack totals got the attention of Steelers chairman Dan Rooney following the 2011 season. Rooney called for Mike Tomlin and the Steelers to change their offensive philosophy in favor of quicker, short-range passing plays and a steadier diet of running plays. That's that main reason why Todd Haley was brought in to replace the popular Bruce Arians heading into the 2012 season

http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/pittsburgh-steelers-opinions-reactions-news-updates/2015/6/2/8703681/despite-record-setting-sack-totals-steelers-qb-ben-roethlisberger

Arains had about as much to do with the Steelers 2007 - 2011 success as the crowing of a rooster does with causing the Sun to rise.

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Because Ben was getting the crap kicked out of him and going forward the team was not going to be able to rely on a perennial #1 defense?

Perennial #1 defense my ass.  Ben made LeBeau a legend, and a lot of defensive players rich.  

Before Ben?  LeBeau's clame to fame was gagging in two Super Bowls.  

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Ben's alarming sack totals got the attention of Steelers chairman Dan Rooney following the 2011 season. Rooney called for Mike Tomlin and the Steelers to change their offensive philosophy in favor of quicker, short-range passing plays and a steadier diet of running plays. That's that main reason why Todd Haley was brought in to replace the popular Bruce Arians heading into the 2012 season

And yet Ben still gets clobbered more than anyone in the league according to his right tackle.  

And if Haley was hired for a "steadier diet of running plays" then he should be fired. Because Ben throws more now than he ever did under Arians.

No, Ben was told to change, and Arians fired, simply because Art II wanted to put the two time accused rapist in his place, simply because he could.

Art II is US Bates.

Only in Yinzer Pittsburgh do fans want, and condone, turning the modern day Terry Bradshaw, into Trent Dilfer 2000.  

It's worked out so well.  

If the Steelers REALLY cared about Ben's well-being?  They would have done what was needed, to get Joe Thomas here during the bye week and end the God-awful Alexandro Villanueva disaster.  

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Arains had about as much to do with the Steelers 2007 - 2011 success as the crowing of a rooster does with causing the Sun to rise.

That's just silly and ignorant.  Another slam at Ben's Pre-Haley work.  And you guys call ME a troll?  

More worried about Dick LeBeau's BS reputation than what actually happens on the field.  

PS.....It was silver spooned Art Rooney II who overruled his head coach.

Atlanta Dan wrote:

MrFootball wrote:

Perennial #1 defense my ass.  Ben made LeBeau a legend, and a lot of defensive players rich.

How can Ben have all those 4th quarter comebacks if the defense is playing sound in the 4th quarter?

It can't happen. Not possible.

Btw, since you love "#1 rankings", Haley had the #1 "ranked" defense in 2012 and went 8-8.

He's a genius.

MrFootball wrote:

Atlanta Dan wrote:

MrFootball wrote:

Perennial #1 defense my ass.  Ben made LeBeau a legend, and a lot of defensive players rich.

How can Ben have all those 4th quarter comebacks if the defense is playing sound in the 4th quarter?

It can't happen.  Not possible.  

Btw, since you love "#1 rankings", Haley had the #1 "ranked" defense in 2012 and went 8-8.  

He's a genius.  

Crash, or Crash's cousin, or whoever you are.. Why don't you just give it up already? Bruce is gone, he's been gone for years, he's not coming back. You hold a grudge like a 14 year old teenage girl who just got told that her boyfriend was talking to some other girl.

Any smart, realistic Steelers fan should be livid, at what Art Rooney II did to this team, to Ben, and to this fan base.

It's not about Arians, it's about ART II playing Jerry Jones and costing his team another chance at a title. What Art II did was worse than what Al Davis did to Marcus Allen. At least Al wanted a freak like Bo Jackson to be the starter. Art gave Ben Todd freaking Haley who FORBID a three time AFC and two time SB winner QB to change the plays at the LOS. Ben's desire to play for one team must be pretty strong because if that was me? I would walked out the door at that moment.

Designs his own offense, and goes to the SB twice running it, and some clown who's never played a down of football is going to forbid me to change plays in my 9th season? Get freaking real.

Ask yourself this question: What would you do if Kraft told Brady how to play?

You'd laugh at him.

So why does Art II get a free pass?

MrFootball wrote:

Any smart, realistic Steelers fan should be livid, at what Art Rooney II did to this team, to Ben, and to this fan base.  

It's not about Arians, it's about ART II playing Jerry Jones and costing his team another chance at a title.  What Art II did was worse than what Al Davis did to Marcus Allen.  At least Al wanted a freak like Bo Jackson to be the starter.  Art gave Ben Todd freaking Haley who FORBID a three time AFC and two time SB winner QB to change the plays at the LOS.  Ben's desire to play for one team must be pretty strong because if that was me?  I would walked out the door at that moment.

Designs his own offense, and goes to the SB twice running it, and some clown who's never played a down of football is going to forbid me to change plays in my 9th season?  Get freaking real.  

Ask yourself this question:  What would you do if Kraft told Brady how to play?

You'd laugh at him.  

So why does Art II get a free pass?  

that is the farthest stretch from the truth I've seen you make since you still used 'Crash' in your name.

I guess we can all be thankful you're not Ben
We'd be even more thankful if you gave yourself a self-imposed permanent ban from any and all Steelers forums

What everyone is laughing at is you!

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that is the farthest stretch from the truth I've seen you make since you still used 'Crash' in your name.

Art II told Ben to "tweak his game".  That' telling Ben, after three SB games and two rings, how to play.  

What's Art II's background on quarterback expertise?  What are his credentials that enable him to tell Ben how to play his position?

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What everyone is laughing at is you!

They should be laughing, or livid, that this team has scored 20 points or less on offesne, in 29 of their past 59 games since 2013, almost a 50/50 split. That's includes UNDER 20, in three playoff games.

It saddens me, that people are MORE CONCERNED, with Todd Haley's Steelers employment, than winning Super Bowls.

It's simple: Promote Fichtner, three wides, no subbing unless an injury or a WR asks for it, and use your backup RB every 3rd series whither he carries the ball or not.

Win the North.

But "fans" like you, would rather lose games with Haley, than win a Super Bowl, without him.

MrFootball wrote:

Art II told Ben to "tweak his game".  That' telling Ben, after three SB games and two rings, how to play.  

What's Art II's background on quarterback expertise?  What are his credentials that enable him to tell Ben how to play his position?

Do you know who agrees with Rooney? Ben.

"Maybe I need to [change my game], but I can't get myself to do it," Roethlisberger said, via ESPN.

Sometimes we're our own worst enemies and need someone else to look out for our best interests. Rooney didn't want Ben to change in order to sabotage him, as you like to think. He wanted Ben to change in order to extend his career.

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Do you know who agrees with Rooney? Ben.

"Maybe I need to [change my game], but I can't get myself to do it," Roethlisberger said, via ESPN.

What do you expect him to say in that instance?  The truth?  

"I only know how to play one way Coach"  

-Ben Roethlisberger during the 2009 Chargers game, to Coach Mike Tomlin.

It's just like when the players are asked about Heinz Field's playing surface, every player tells the media they like the field, it's grass, we have the advantage, etc.  

But then the players survey on NFL fields comes out after the season, and the Steelers players, without a camera in their face, vote their own surface, the worst in the league.  

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He wanted Ben to change in order to extend his career.

I would rather have seen Ben play three more years, win another ring, and retire after 11, 12 seasons, than subject him to this five year shit show with Todd Haley.  

Haley's ONLY answer, is to try and run the ball more.  He does NOTHING, to enhance Ben's durability.  Hell he does nothing to try and help Bell or DW either.  Just runs them each into the ground until they get hurt.  Then Haley apologists cry when we play playoff games with street free agents and practice squad players.

Look at Whiz in 2005: He had Parker, Bettis, AND 3rd down back Verron Haynes.

Look at BA in 2008: He had Parker, Moore, Russell, and Carey Davis #38 seeing snaps on 3rd downs.

But Haley doesn't try to preserve Bell, then he won't try to preserve DW when Bell gets hurt.  

Ben is left in too many predictable situations, and defenders just tee off on him.  

"Ben's hit more than any player in this league and never complains"  

-Marcus Gilbert October 2016  

The defense rests.

MrFootball wrote:

Any smart, realistic Steelers fan should be livid, at what Art Rooney II did to this team, to Ben, and to this fan base.  

It's not about Arians, it's about ART II playing Jerry Jones and costing his team another chance at a title.  What Art II did was worse than what Al Davis did to Marcus Allen.  At least Al wanted a freak like Bo Jackson to be the starter.  Art gave Ben Todd freaking Haley who FORBID a three time AFC and two time SB winner QB to change the plays at the LOS.  Ben's desire to play for one team must be pretty strong because if that was me?  I would walked out the door at that moment.

Designs his own offense, and goes to the SB twice running it, and some clown who's never played a down of football is going to forbid me to change plays in my 9th season?  Get freaking real.  

Ask yourself this question:  What would you do if Kraft told Brady how to play?

You'd laugh at him.  

So why does Art II get a free pass?  

Some people on this board think you are entertaining (mostly you). It's obvious you hate Haley and Art II. Because you are consumed with this hatred you can't possibly be objective. The worst part about you is your arrogance and insistence that anyone who does not agree with you (pretty much everyone here) is stupid. My question is:why do you bother? Log off and don't let the door hit you in your head up your ass.

Actually you've got it backwards.  

I don't call people trolls, or not Steelers fans when they don't agree with me.  

You can have your opinion, hell I could even agree with it if it makes sense.  

But basically this whole board is "Todd Haley is great, and anyone who disagrees, despite the FACTS they give to voice that opinion, is a troll".  

There's nothing to be objective about Haley.  His offense sucks.  His offense doesn't keep quarterbacks healthy, and his offense has won one playoff game in the 7 years he's been able to install it in two cities and has yet to score 20 points in any playoff game he's coached in since 2009 with it.  

He's basically Bruce Coslet with a beard:  In way over his head.  His hire was a failure, and Steelers history and those who follow it knew it would be.

And the sooner Art II can get that through his head?  Or maybe Dan has to step in and do it for him? The better off this team will be.  

Like I said, people are more concerned with Todd Haley running the offense, than they are winning titles now.  

And that's sad.

MrFootball wrote:

Any smart, realistic Steelers fan should be livid, at what Art Rooney II did to this team, to Ben, and to this fan base.  

It's not about Arians, it's about ART II playing Jerry Jones and costing his team another chance at a title.  What Art II did was worse than what Al Davis did to Marcus Allen.  At least Al wanted a freak like Bo Jackson to be the starter.  Art gave Ben Todd freaking Haley who FORBID a three time AFC and two time SB winner QB to change the plays at the LOS.  Ben's desire to play for one team must be pretty strong because if that was me?  I would walked out the door at that moment.

Designs his own offense, and goes to the SB twice running it, and some clown who's never played a down of football is going to forbid me to change plays in my 9th season?  Get freaking real.  

Ask yourself this question:  What would you do if Kraft told Brady how to play?

You'd laugh at him.  

So why does Art II get a free pass?  

Answer the question.  

Don't duck it.  

Aren't you sick of watching Ben's career get wasted with this arrangement?  

I know I am.  

Too bad Thomas Tull couldn't buy out the Rooney's with his billions.  Maybe then he'd assign Art II to make his coffee in the morning.

What really sucks is Ben and Tomlin are going to be the ones to pay the price. Then Haley and Landry Jones get their chance.

That'll be fun. LOL

MrFootball wrote:

And that's sad.

what's sad is that you're posting here again...

From the looks of the front page NO ONE posts here.

Like I said before, it's a ghost town here. Heavy handed mods who don't allow a difference of opinion kills message boards.

The excuse in July was "It's the off-season"

Now we're 8 games in, and the activity here is non-existent.

MrFootball wrote:

From the looks of the front page NO ONE posts here.  

Like I said before, it's a ghost town here.  Heavy handed mods who don't allow a difference of opinion kills message boards.  

The excuse in July was "It's the off-season"  

Now we're 8 games in, and the activity here is non-existent.  

then why do you bother posting here?

go take your amazing wisdom and annoy the fuck out of other message boards.

oh yeah, you've been banned multiple times at all those other boards also...

Hawaii 5-0 wrote:

MrFootball wrote:

From the looks of the front page NO ONE posts here.  

Like I said before, it's a ghost town here.  Heavy handed mods who don't allow a difference of opinion kills message boards.  

The excuse in July was "It's the off-season"  

Now we're 8 games in, and the activity here is non-existent.  

then why do you bother posting here?

go take your amazing wisdom and annoy the fuck out of other message boards.

oh yeah, you've been banned multiple times at all those other boards also...

I'd rather be banned for having my opinion, than run away like you did on Planet.

MrFootball wrote:

Hawaii 5-0 wrote:

MrFootball wrote:

From the looks of the front page NO ONE posts here.  

Like I said before, it's a ghost town here.  Heavy handed mods who don't allow a difference of opinion kills message boards.  

The excuse in July was "It's the off-season"  

Now we're 8 games in, and the activity here is non-existent.  

then why do you bother posting here?

go take your amazing wisdom and annoy the fuck out of other message boards.

oh yeah, you've been banned multiple times at all those other boards also...

I'd rather be banned for having my opinion, than run away like you did on Planet.    

I left Planet because you were too fucking annoying and the board couldn't find a way to identify your ip address every time you created yet another new profile.

and when other posters suggested i should just ignore your annoying ass instead of calling you out for the fucking obnoxious jerk you are I decided to leave...