Steelers looking to acquire a top tier receiver

Not done yet...

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/report-steelers-looking-aquire-top-145437182.html

i would have mixed emotions if they bring in a big name high dollar FA WR. i mean should they be investing big money and draft capital  in a receiver when they have done ZERO to fix the oline or dline ?
i mean unless arthur smith has changed his run first philosophy, good blockers....kind of important.
the only center on the roster is an undrafted practice squad player. have they learned nothing about not having options on the oline and being forced to start rookies ? they had mitch morse in for a visit. he only signed a 2 year 10.5 million deal with the jags...
Relying on the draft to get not one but two starter quality olinemen is a bad strategy. especially without a backup plan in the event you draft a dud. unless of course , tomlin is happy with dan moore and intends for him to start again at LT which would not surprise me at all. both russ wilson and fields take a lot of sacks and are known for fumbles....just sayin...

considering the way OT's fly off the board, and given the fact that there are so few quality centers in this draft unlike WR, i dont like the odds of filling the oline holes. they either get one or the other at pick 20. round two the odds decrease dramatically for getting the other. round two looks good for a wr IMO.
There also looks to be a huge shortage of 3-4 suitable DL in this draft.

Master_Of_Puppets wrote:

i would have mixed emotions if they bring in a big name high dollar FA WR. i mean should they be investing big money and draft capital  in a receiver when they have done ZERO to fix the oline or dline ?
i mean unless arthur smith has changed his run first philosophy, good blockers....kind of important.
the only center on the roster is an undrafted practice squad player. have they learned nothing about not having options on the oline and being forced to start rookies ? they had mitch morse in for a visit. he only signed a 2 year 10.5 million deal with the jags...
Relying on the draft to get not one but two starter quality olinemen is a bad strategy. especially without a backup plan in the event you draft a dud. unless of course , tomlin is happy with dan moore and intends for him to start again at LT which would not surprise me at all.   both russ wilson and fields take a lot of sacks and are known for fumbles....just sayin...

considering the way OT's fly off the board, and given the fact that there are so few quality centers in this draft unlike WR, i dont like the odds of filling the oline holes. they either get one or the other at pick 20. round two the odds decrease dramatically for getting the other. round two looks good for a wr IMO.
There also looks to be a huge shortage of 3-4 suitable DL in this draft.

You've been stressing the importance of building the O-line first for a couple years now - and you've been right.

My thoughts on signing a receiver were that they could then target O-line with the first 2 picks. But you make a good point about counting on two rookies in the same year (especially with the late-season rookie swoon). Perhaps we still go O-line the first two rounds, but are prepared for at least one of them to sit for a bit. IF the decision is one O-lineman in the first two rounds, then my preference would be to lock down the best center in the draft (Jackson Powers-Johnson). Perhaps sign an O-lineman in round 3.

They could also sign Mike Williams. Good upside if he's healthy. That signing wouldn't surprise me.

Great Randino wrote:

Master_Of_Puppets wrote:

i would have mixed emotions if they bring in a big name high dollar FA WR. i mean should they be investing big money and draft capital  in a receiver when they have done ZERO to fix the oline or dline ?
i mean unless arthur smith has changed his run first philosophy, good blockers....kind of important.
the only center on the roster is an undrafted practice squad player. have they learned nothing about not having options on the oline and being forced to start rookies ? they had mitch morse in for a visit. he only signed a 2 year 10.5 million deal with the jags...
Relying on the draft to get not one but two starter quality olinemen is a bad strategy. especially without a backup plan in the event you draft a dud. unless of course , tomlin is happy with dan moore and intends for him to start again at LT which would not surprise me at all.   both russ wilson and fields take a lot of sacks and are known for fumbles....just sayin...

considering the way OT's fly off the board, and given the fact that there are so few quality centers in this draft unlike WR, i dont like the odds of filling the oline holes. they either get one or the other at pick 20. round two the odds decrease dramatically for getting the other. round two looks good for a wr IMO.
There also looks to be a huge shortage of 3-4 suitable DL in this draft.

You've been stressing the importance of building the O-line first for a couple years now - and you've been right.  

My thoughts on signing a receiver were that they could then target O-line with the first 2 picks.  But you make a good point about counting on two rookies in the same year (especially with the late-season rookie swoon).  Perhaps we still go O-line the first two rounds, but are prepared for at least one of them to sit for a bit.  IF the decision is one O-lineman in the first two rounds, then my preference would be to lock down the best center in the draft (Jackson Powers-Johnson).  Perhaps sign an O-lineman in round 3.  

They could also sign Mike Williams.  Good upside if he's healthy.  That signing wouldn't surprise me.

im thinking more along the line of , maybe there wont be a tackle or center worthy of the 51st pick . we will not be the only team that needs T or C in the 2nd round. if you take a center first, you might be compelled to reach (see edmunds, see artie burns) , or wait until the 3rd or 4th to get a tackle of appropriate value. or take the tackle first and the same scenario applies for a C. can you think of the last actually good olineman the steelers got later than the 2nd round ? kelvin beachum ?

i was suggesting if neither T or C of value is there in 2, there will be some interesting WR prospects available in 2. pay a kings ransom for WR now , and taking a WR that early makes no sense. the 2nd also might present a  opportunity for a Dlinemen that might not be available again in this draft.

I think Center is really, really important.  I probably value it more than many people do.  But the argument could be made that a quality OT will be available in round 1 and a quality C will be available in round 2 (Draftek has Jackson Powers-Johnson ranked at 29 overall, Barton at 49, Frazier at 54 and Van Pran at 84.  How close in talent are they?  I wouldn't know.  But JP-J seems like the consensus #1.

To your point, however:  if in round 2, the value isn't there for OL, there will certainly be value at WR.

I would still be good with trading for Aiyuk if the value is there (i.e., we can fleece the 9ers).  I wouldn't worry about run-heavy vs pass-heavy.  You have to be able to do both anyway.  If you can't throw the ball, they load the box and stop your run.  If you can't run the ball...you get the point.  

One thing for sure, Khan's moves have given us a lot more flexibility in the draft.  He's done a terrific job thus far.

PS. Just saw that Williams signed with the Jets. Its been quiet on the Tyler Boyd front, but that still wouldn't surprise me either.

Great Randino wrote:

I think Center is really, really important.  I probably value it more than many people do.  But the argument could be made that a quality OT will be available in round 1 and a quality C will be available in round 2 (Draftek has Jackson Powers-Johnson ranked at 29 overall, Barton at 49, Frazier at 54 and Van Pran at 84.  How close in talent are they?  I wouldn't know.  But JP-J seems like the consensus #1.

To your point, however:  if in round 2, the value isn't there for OL, there will certainly be value at WR.

I would still be good with trading for Aiyuk if the value is there (i.e., we can fleece the 9ers).  I wouldn't worry about run-heavy vs pass-heavy.  You have to be able to do both anyway.  If you can't throw the ball, they load the box and stop your run.  If you can't run the ball...you get the point.  

One thing for sure, Khan's moves have given us a lot more flexibility in the draft.  He's done a terrific job thus far.

PS. Just saw that Williams signed with the Jets.   Its been quiet on the Tyler Boyd front, but that still wouldn't surprise me either.

barton played center his freshmen year at duke (430 SNAPS) . the other 3 years he was a LT. so he has maybe 3 games more experience than green did at center.   the draft pundits are projected him to move inside because he has short arms. give me a guy that has been a dedicated center.

Van Pram weighed in at 298 lbs at the combine. he is projected as a 3rd. he is considered a work in progress despite 43 starts in 3 years. i mean he cant be worse than green, but i personally feel better with a bit bigger center anchoring the line.

frazier is penciled in as a 2nd by literally every draftnik. problem is, there is no guarantee he will be there at 51. most of the mocks i have seen have him gone before the steelers pick. someone noted Tomlin spent a lot of time around him during senior bowl week.

johnson is considered the top interior Olinemen in this draft. he has the size, athleticism, and enough strength (30 bench reps)  to be a good center. he is considered a day 1 starter. center draft history dictates he will be there at 20, but the dolphins who sit at 21 dont have a starting center either. they could get in front of us to get him. fortunately the dolphins are a bit light on draft capital. they dont have a 3rd or 4th pick.
i would rather have the best center in the draft than the 5th or 6th best tackle.

i have been pissed off more than one draft because they passed on the center i wanted.  i lost my shit when they passed on creed humphry in rd 2, hell i would have used the 24th on him instead of najee. then they passed on PRO BOWLER Tyler linderbaum for pickett     oh by the way, he still plays for the ravens. where's kenny ?  
to sum it up , we wasted a 1st and a 3rd and still need a center.
winstn churchill said , " you can count on americans to do the right thing...after they have tried everything else".
that sums up the steelers approach to the lines.

I'd love Aiyuk or Tee Higgins

Master_Of_Puppets wrote:

Great Randino wrote:

I think Center is really, really important.  I probably value it more than many people do.  But the argument could be made that a quality OT will be available in round 1 and a quality C will be available in round 2 (Draftek has Jackson Powers-Johnson ranked at 29 overall, Barton at 49, Frazier at 54 and Van Pran at 84.  How close in talent are they?  I wouldn't know.  But JP-J seems like the consensus #1.

To your point, however:  if in round 2, the value isn't there for OL, there will certainly be value at WR.

I would still be good with trading for Aiyuk if the value is there (i.e., we can fleece the 9ers).  I wouldn't worry about run-heavy vs pass-heavy.  You have to be able to do both anyway.  If you can't throw the ball, they load the box and stop your run.  If you can't run the ball...you get the point.  

One thing for sure, Khan's moves have given us a lot more flexibility in the draft.  He's done a terrific job thus far.

PS. Just saw that Williams signed with the Jets.   Its been quiet on the Tyler Boyd front, but that still wouldn't surprise me either.

barton played center his freshmen year at duke (430 SNAPS) . the other 3 years he was a LT. so he has maybe 3 games more experience than green did at center.   the draft pundits are projected him to move inside because he has short arms. give me a guy that has been a dedicated center.

Van Pram weighed in at 298 lbs at the combine. he is projected as a 3rd. he is considered a work in progress despite 43 starts in 3 years. i mean he cant be worse than green, but i personally feel better with a bit bigger center anchoring the line.

frazier is penciled in as a 2nd by literally every draftnik. problem is, there is no guarantee he will be there at 51. most of the mocks i have seen have him gone before the steelers pick. someone noted Tomlin spent a lot of time around him during senior bowl week.

johnson is considered the top interior Olinemen in this draft. he has the size, athleticism, and enough strength (30 bench reps)  to be a good center. he is considered a day 1 starter. center draft history dictates he will be there at 20, but the dolphins who sit at 21 dont have a starting center either. they could get in front of us to get him. fortunately the dolphins are a bit light on draft capital. they dont have a 3rd or 4th pick.
i would rather have the best center in the draft than the 5th or 6th best tackle.

i have been pissed off more than one draft because they passed on the center i wanted.  i lost my shit when they passed on creed humphry in rd 2, hell i would have used the 24th on him instead of najee. then they passed on PRO BOWLER Tyler linderbaum for pickett     oh by the way, he still plays for the ravens. where's kenny ?  
to sum it up , we wasted a 1st and a 3rd and still need a center.
winstn churchill said , " you can count on americans to do the right thing...after they have tried everything else".
that sums up the steelers approach to the lines.

Again, you turned out to be right about Humphries. And I really agree with you about the position.

Didn't know that about Barton. I'd cross him out then. I'd also move up to assure we get the best center in the draft, JP-J. Don't let the Dolphins snipe us.

Shalieve5090 wrote:

I'd love Aiyuk or Tee Higgins

Higgins has been franchise-tagged. They might trade him but it won't be to us.

I'd love to have Aiyuk.

While I'd like to have Aiyuk, I wouldn't trade a high draft pick for him and I'm afraid that's what it takes to get him. On the other hand I would go completely bananas if we would trade for Deebo Samuel. He's my favorite non Steeler player. He's not only talented, he's hardnosed as well. Both Aiyuk and Samuel are willing blockers and would be a perfect fit in Arthur Smith's offense.

As for the OL, there's also a possibility there's already a solution in house (not for center, they need to draft one). They can move Broderick Jones to LT and maybe Spencer Anderson can become the starting RT. He was drafted last year in the 7th round, saw the field in the last 6 games and was dressed for every other game. Let's see if he develops. Don't get me wrong, I don't like Dan Moore either, but we have some bigger needs right now: a starting center, WR#2 (and we even need a real #3), starting slot CB (and we need a #4 to be the primary backup as well). Then there's OT and DL. Still a lot of holes to fix and it all can't be done this year.

There is still a decent sum of money that can be had with some restructured contracts as well. They can plug a few more holes with free agents.

Perhaps it's time to take a hard look at Calvin Austin III. Maybe he can be the answer at slot receiver?

Great Randino wrote:

Perhaps it's time to take a hard look at Calvin Austin III.  Maybe he can be the answer at slot receiver?

Slot receivers in Smiths offense are asked to block a lot. I don't think Austin has the size or frame to do that well. They could kick him to the outside not sure if that would work though.

SteelerFreak58 wrote:

There is still a decent sum of money that can be had with some restructured contracts as well. They can plug a few more holes with free agents.

i would also throw out there they could cut james daniels and find a FA guard for half of daniels 8 million salary and get the same level of play. daniels isnt the worst, but he also isnt that good. there's a few guards they should kick the tires on.

i would also like to see them explore a long term deal with connor williams. he has improved his PFF grade every year since he has been in the league. he was a free agent signing i wanted the steelers to make when he didnt re-sign with the cowboys. he really hit his stride when the dolphins moved him to center, but has always been a solid guard.
i think a lot of teams will shy away from him because he wont be available for a few weeks to start the season. i dont know how it will effect his bargaining power, and regardless he still wont be cheap , but he would instantly upgrade the interior of the line and offer flexibility.
anyway i think it would be a good future investment...

here is his PFF grade progression. for comparison james daniels had a 62 grade for 2023. daniels also drafted in 2018 has a high grade of 71.8 in 2021. his grade dropped in 2022 and then again in 2023. daniels definitely has been better in sacks allowed and penalties. so obviously the difference being in the run blocking.

rookie year 2018 - 60 ...688 snaps
2019 - 60.9...727 snaps
2020 - 71.2...1146 snaps
2021 - 76.1...948 snaps
2022 - 78.2...1056 snaps
2023 @ C - 86.5 ...497 snaps

Master_Of_Puppets wrote:

i would also like to see them explore a long term deal with connor williams. he has improved his PFF grade every year since he has been in the league. he was a free agent signing i wanted the steelers to make when he didnt re-sign with the cowboys. he really hit his stride when the dolphins moved him to center, but has always been a solid guard.
i think a lot of teams will shy away from him because he wont be available for a few weeks to start the season. i dont know how it will effect his bargaining power, and regardless he still wont be cheap , but he would instantly upgrade the interior of the line and offer flexibility.
anyway i think it would be a good future investment...

here is his PFF grade progression. for comparison james daniels had a 62 grade for 2023

rookie year 2018 - 60 ...688 snaps
2019 - 60.9...727 snaps
2020 - 71.2...1146 snaps
2021 - 76.1...948 snaps
2022 - 78.2...1056 snaps
2023 @ C - 86.5 ...497 snaps 

They should try to grab Williams as long as his price isn't to high. He can be the starting Center or Guard in our system depending on who they draft. If they get him let Herbig play center until he comes in. Dalton Risner is floating out there but his stats are close to Daniels stats and it seems like it wouldn't be much of an upgrade.

Daniels didn't play horrible he only had 3 penalties and gave up only 1 sack last year. His run blocking wasn't too bad either but I also think Cole and Okorafor were holding Daniels back.

I really want them to grab either Powers or Frazier for Center. I am leaning more towards Frazier in round 2 he was a 4 time State Wrestling champ that tells me he is a ridiculously athletic kid with great hands and a hell of a motor. His highlight real is impressive and he has few holes in his game.

spotrac has a projected contract of 13.5 million a year. spotrac also they had projected patrick queen getting 18 million a year. we all know he is getting 13.

if they could pick up williams for 11.5 maybe 12  i wouldnt complain considering they paid daniels about 9.

Shalieve5090 wrote:

I'd love Aiyuk or Tee Higgins

i dont think they should fork out anymore huge contracts until they get the QB situation resolved and find out how much they are going to be paying out for a QB a few years from now. i mean if wilson balls out and they want him to stay for a few more years, boom now they have a 40 million a year contract to work in. or maybe fields balls out in 2025,,,boom same situation.
the chargers and vikings had so many big contracts they had to sharpen up the axe twice they had so many star players they had to cut. now they both have 50+ million in dead cap they have to eat this year.
they have pickens to do the heavy lifting this year. they dont need another receiver to compete for the #1 spot. they just need someone to compliment george and help move the chains. a draft pick and maybe a cap friendly vet WR is all they need for now.
i have no faith in calvin austin to be the receiver they need. they should just go ahead and add him to the list of undersized, speed demon failed experiments they try every couple years. as someone else said, the slot receiver doesnt have much of a role in arthur smiths offense.

I have no faith in CA III either. The last 5 games he had... 0 catches. And more importantly like SteelerFreak58 said he doesn't fit Arthur Smith's offense.

Master_Of_Puppets wrote:

SteelerFreak58 wrote:

There is still a decent sum of money that can be had with some restructured contracts as well. They can plug a few more holes with free agents.

i would also throw out there they could cut james daniels and find a FA guard for half of daniels 8 million salary and get the same level of play. daniels isnt the worst, but he also isnt that good.  there's a few guards they should kick the tires on.

I wouldn't cut Daniels for a couple of reasons. First of all, he's better than he's shown so far with us. This due to circumstances, he had to play next to Cole and Okarafor. Two bums which made it difficult for him. Then Okarafor was replaced by a rookie who wasn't used to play that position. Jones improved somewhat during the season and was certainly an upgrade over Okorafor, but still not a world beater by any means. So Daniels has been put in a tough spot in his two seasons playing for us and still held up fairly well. Second, the more players you replace on the OL the longer it will take them to learn our system and to gell as a unit. We already need to replace our center and ideally we move Jones to LT which means we only have Seumalo and Daniels who will stay at their spot from last season.

I really don't want them to send out high picks for a WR#2 (Aiyuk trade). We have Pickens we can get a quality WR in round 3.

We need an answer for Center and Right Tackle. We also need to get younger on the DL. A WR can come in at round 3 and we should be good to go.

I doubt they will go for Aiyuk unless they can get him on the cheap, no higher than a 3rd rounder.

https://www.steelers.com/video/watch-2024-draft-triple-take-mock-draft-2-0

Josh Reynolds is out there he could be a possibility.

can someone explain to me how odell beckham is still getting teams to pay him like he is good receiver ? he hasnt had a 1k yard season since 2019. spotrac has his projected market value at 11.9 million.
i mean 10-12 million a year for 30-40 receptions seems steep to me.
its not just beckham. micheal thomas, DJ Clark. 2 more guys that havent put up good stats in years, yet projected for the 10 million club.
meanwhile slot receivers like boyd or hunter renfrow ,who actually could put up better stats on the right team, are projected for millions less. hunter renfrow would put up monster numbers if he had played with a guy like manning or brady.