Subject: Re: Pittsburgh Steelers 2022 Mock Drafts Mon Nov 15, 2021 2:21 am
Great Randino wrote:
He's nowhere close to Lamar Jackson. He should never be mentioned in the same breath as Lamar.
Never ever.
you seem to have a much higher opinion of lamar as a QB than i do. he reminds me too much of kordell. they can win a lot of regular season games , then he shits himself in the playoffs. his playoff record is 1-3 . completion percentage a whopping 55.8% ...3 touchdowns and 5 interceptions...has fumbled 5 times...and sacked 19 times. remember this is for 4 games.
Great Randino
Posts : 2371 Join date : 2018-08-31
Subject: Re: Pittsburgh Steelers 2022 Mock Drafts Mon Nov 15, 2021 11:19 am
I loved Kordell, but he was never the playmaker that Lamar has been.
I loved Kordell, but he was never the playmaker that Lamar has been.
i think perhaps you have forgotten how many games kordell as a starter pretty much single handedly blew for us. kordell threw more pics than touchdowns and saved his worst for the big games. 2 tds and 8 picks in the playoffs. what about kordells career stats suggest he was a good QB ? key word QB , not athlete.
SteelerFreak58 likes this post
SteelerFreak58
Posts : 2690 Join date : 2015-09-13 Location : Modesto CA
I loved Kordell, but he was never the playmaker that Lamar has been.
i think perhaps you have forgotten how many games kordell as a starter pretty much single handedly blew for us. kordell threw more pics than touchdowns and saved his worst for the big games. 2 tds and 8 picks in the playoffs. what about kordells career stats suggest he was a good QB ? key word QB , not athlete.
Steeler fans were starving for a QB by that point especially with the O'Donnell let down in 95. Kordell had his moments but over all he was terrible. The Defense got us into the Playoffs and Kordell lost the playoff games with horrendous outings. Man those Defenses went to waste... such a shame.
I loved Kordell, but he was never the playmaker that Lamar has been.
i think perhaps you have forgotten how many games kordell as a starter pretty much single handedly blew for us. kordell threw more pics than touchdowns and saved his worst for the big games. 2 tds and 8 picks in the playoffs. what about kordells career stats suggest he was a good QB ? key word QB , not athlete.
Steeler fans were starving for a QB by that point especially with the O'Donnell let down in 95. Kordell had his moments but over all he was terrible. The Defense got us into the Playoffs and Kordell lost the playoff games with horrendous outings. Man those Defenses went to waste... such a shame.
EXACTLY...thank God for tommy maddox ending that horrible experiment. i liked Cowhers coaching style and the physical toughness he demand from his teams, but i was pissed and wanted him gone for allowing kordell to ruin seasons for so long. my asshole brother bought me a kordell jersey for christmas one year just to get a laugh at my reaction. joke was on him after i sold it for 10 bucks... had kordell not been such a stubborn dick he could have had a long successful career as a WR /RB/Gadget guy. maybe even HOF worthy. was kordell the inspiration of the wildcat ?
there are common traits among running QB's (not to be confused with QB's who can run) 1 spotty accuracy 2 poor decision making 3 they get sacked a lot
my theory is it goes back to what i call athlete arrogance. these guys will not throw the ball away. they think they can escape the pass rush every time , which leads to the sacks and poor throws, and bad decisions. they dont keep their eyes downfield because they are looking for where they are going to run. since they dont keep their eyes downfield ,they dont know where the coverage is when they make a snap decision to throw the ball without proper mechanics, which leads to the bad passes and interception.
I loved Kordell, but he was never the playmaker that Lamar has been.
i think perhaps you have forgotten how many games kordell as a starter pretty much single handedly blew for us. kordell threw more pics than touchdowns and saved his worst for the big games. 2 tds and 8 picks in the playoffs. what about kordells career stats suggest he was a good QB ? key word QB , not athlete.
Steeler fans were starving for a QB by that point especially with the O'Donnell let down in 95. Kordell had his moments but over all he was terrible. The Defense got us into the Playoffs and Kordell lost the playoff games with horrendous outings. Man those Defenses went to waste... such a shame.
EXACTLY...thank God for tommy maddox ending that horrible experiment. i liked Cowhers coaching style and the physical toughness he demand from his teams, but i was pissed and wanted him gone for allowing kordell to ruin seasons for so long. my asshole brother bought me a kordell jersey for christmas one year just to get a laugh at my reaction. joke was on him after i sold it for 10 bucks... had kordell not been such a stubborn dick he could have had a long successful career as a WR /RB/Gadget guy. maybe even HOF worthy. was kordell the inspiration of the wildcat ?
I think you're arguing with someone who agrees with you.
I said Kordell was never the playmaker that Lamar has been.
And then you display a chart of facts that back up my point.
well you did throw this in there which led me to believe you thought kordell was a good QB. so what was it to make you love kordell ?
Quote :
I loved Kordell,
i also posted jacksons playoff stats , which supports my point. im not disputing who was the better athlete. lamar is better as a qb than kordell. but he also displays the same problems that kordell did. spotty accuracy, bad decisions, gets sacked a lot and shits himself in big games. malik wilson also has the same deficiencies.
Quote :
his playoff record is 1-3 . completion percentage a whopping 55.8% ...3 touchdowns and 5 interceptions...has fumbled 5 times...and sacked 19 times. remember this is for 4 games.
LambertWardSteel
Posts : 1643 Join date : 2015-05-14 Location : Myerstown PA
well you did throw this in there which led me to believe you thought kordell was a good QB. so what was it to make you love kordell ?
Quote :
I loved Kordell,
i also posted jacksons playoff stats , which supports my point. im not disputing who was the better athlete. lamar is better as a qb than kordell. but he also displays the same problems that kordell did. spotty accuracy, bad decisions, gets sacked a lot and shits himself in big games.
Quote :
his playoff record is 1-3 . completion percentage a whopping 55.8% ...3 touchdowns and 5 interceptions...has fumbled 5 times...and sacked 19 times. remember this is for 4 games.
The running QBs like Stewart, Vick, Jackson, and all the rest, historically have had short shelf lives. As you mention, they also don't seem to do well when they are center stage in the playoffs against the best teams of that season. I'm hoping the rats give him about a $40 million dollar a year long term contract real soon.
I agree with you, it would have been awesome to see Stewart remain in a slash role his entire career. It would have been lethal to have a football "utility infielder" with his speed and elusiveness line up as WR/RB and have him throw a pass here and there. He very well have been a HOF player had he done that.
The running QBs like Stewart, Vick, Jackson, and all the rest, historically have had short shelf lives. As you mention, they also don't seem to do well when they are center stage in the playoffs against the best teams of that season. I'm hoping the rats give him about a $40 million dollar a year long term contract real soon.
I agree with you, it would have been awesome to see Stewart remain in a slash role his entire career. It would have been lethal to have a football "utility infielder" with his speed and elusiveness line up as WR/RB and have him throw a pass here and there. He very well have been a HOF player had he done that.
lamar jackson is one tackle away from being RG3
speaking of RG3 , he hade a great rookie season. completed 65'5% of his passes .avg 213 yds per game threw 20 TDs and only 5 ints. had an 8.1 yds per attempt. made the playoffs that year . shit to bed. completed 52.6% a whopping 84 yards passing . 1 td 1 int and had a per attempt of 4.4 yds.
Last edited by Master_Of_Puppets on Mon Nov 15, 2021 6:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
I reserve the right to like a player even if he's never a superstar.
Malik Willis - above average QB at a smaller division school who should be a running back. Someone will make the mistake of drafting him, I just hope it isn't us.
I reserve the right to like a player even if he's never a superstar.
Malik Willis - above average QB at a smaller division school who should be a running back. Someone will make the mistake of drafting him, I just hope it isn't us.
sure he will get drafted and should be. just not in the first round, and not by a team that needs an immediate starter. jalen hurts went in the 2nd at pick 53. i like willis coming out of college more than i did hurts. he has more arm talent than hurts. the guy needs a QB coach and a few years of film study..polish this guy up and you might end up with russell wilson. this guy has the same bag of tools wilson has, except between the ears. wilson in college knew when to move out of the pocket. when to tuck it and run when to throw it away. he didnt panic under pressure. wilson was also a 3rd round pick. teams thought he was too short ...
I reserve the right to like a player even if he's never a superstar.
Malik Willis - above average QB at a smaller division school who should be a running back. Someone will make the mistake of drafting him, I just hope it isn't us.
sure he will get drafted and should be. just not in the first round, and not by a team that needs an immediate starter. jalen hurts went in the 2nd at pick 53. i like willis coming out of college more than i did hurts. he has more arm talent than hurts. the guy needs a QB coach and a few years of film study..polish this guy up and you might end up with russell wilson. this guy has the same bag of tools wilson has, except between the ears. wilson in college knew when to move out of the pocket. when to tuck it and run when to throw it away. he didnt panic under pressure. wilson was also a 3rd round pick. teams thought he was too short ...
I actually meant someone will draft him "high". I figured people could probably figure that out though.
Russell Wilson threw 4 interceptions his entire senior year - playing in the Big Ten. His draft status (going in round 3) was because of his height. I'd personally have no problem with a shorter QB.
Willis is already way above 4 Int's - playing at a lower level.
Drafting a QB who is "athletic", and/or "Has a powerful arm", and hoping he develops into a pro QB is a mistake many teams have made through the years. While some do develop, most do not (DeShone Kizer anyone?).
No - he doesn't "have the same tools" as Russell Wilson.
I reserve the right to like a player even if he's never a superstar.
Malik Willis - above average QB at a smaller division school who should be a running back. Someone will make the mistake of drafting him, I just hope it isn't us.
sure he will get drafted and should be. just not in the first round, and not by a team that needs an immediate starter. jalen hurts went in the 2nd at pick 53. i like willis coming out of college more than i did hurts. he has more arm talent than hurts. the guy needs a QB coach and a few years of film study..polish this guy up and you might end up with russell wilson. this guy has the same bag of tools wilson has, except between the ears. wilson in college knew when to move out of the pocket. when to tuck it and run when to throw it away. he didnt panic under pressure. wilson was also a 3rd round pick. teams thought he was too short ...
I actually meant someone will draft him "high". I figured people could probably figure that out though.
Russell Wilson threw 4 interceptions his entire senior year - playing in the Big Ten. His draft status (going in round 3) was because of his height. I'd personally have no problem with a shorter QB.
Willis is already way above 4 Int's - playing at a lower level.
Drafting a QB who is "athletic", and/or "Has a powerful arm", and hoping he develops into a pro QB is a mistake many teams have made through the years. While some do develop, most do not (DeShone Kizer anyone?).
No - he doesn't "have the same tools" as Russell Wilson.
set the stats aside and just look at high lights. you will see them making the same types of WOW ..plays. wilson just made more of them while minimizing mistakes. thats where the "except between the ears things come in". physical talent wise i dont see a difference. the question is can he be coached up. can he be coached out of his bad habits.
a lot of people gloss over the fact that russell wilson played for more than that one great season at wisconsin. he had 3 mediocre seasons at NC state. he was a sub 60% completion guy until Wisconsin . i'd like to see willis stay in college for another year and transfer to a better school.
Okay - I hear ya. I think you've got some valid points. That 17/1 ratio in year 1 was nice...14 INT's in year 3 not so good. But he finished strong his senior year. I'd much rather a guy finish strong the last year than in the previous years, if that makes sense?
I see Willis in his coming out year (?) and making a lot of mistakes. And again, at a much lower level of competition. That would scare me.
You made a good point about Willis staying in college another year. I think that makes the most sense for him too. And then really kick ass in college.
What's your opinion of Matt Corral, Ole Miss? I don't know a lot about him.
What about Desmond Ridder, Cincy?
I just read an article that saw 5 QB's go in the first round, with a 6th as a possibility. That is wild.
i like what i see from corral as a college player , but damn he looks fragile. he is a small guy. he is listed at 6 foot like a lot of these guys, but he isnt 220 or 225 lbs like willis or howell.. he is listed at 200. i was his size my JR year in high school .. how is he going to absorb a hit from miles garrett ? i seen an interview with him and he sounds like he has a bit of a new york or jersey accent but his wikipage says he went to high school in california.
mel kiper says desmond ridder has the most upside because of his intangibles. normally i refuse to agree with kiper out of principle, but he might be right. ridders achilles heel is his accuracy issues. hes got size ,arm strength and mobility but cant hit the broadside of a barn consistently. but you know who had the same problem ? josh allen. i LOL'ed at Iowa steel for pimping allen ... .
at this point after mason stunk it up i just wanna see someone new. its all a big crap shoot anyway. anyone of these guys could end up being a star or they all could be busts. what i do know is if all these guys had been mixed in with lasts years class, the 1st of these guys taken would have been the 6th QB off the board. what puts me off about Ridder is i dont see any real growth (improvement) from last season. thats what i like about pickett. when i see growth i get excited that maybe we havent seen their ceiling yet , when there is no growth im thinking what we have seen is what we get. silly i know ..
Master_Of_Puppets
Posts : 2780 Join date : 2011-04-08
Subject: Re: Pittsburgh Steelers 2022 Mock Drafts Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:05 am
check out this guys youtube channel. he has lots of great break downs of QB's.
Last edited by Master_Of_Puppets on Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
IowaSteeler927
Posts : 5053 Join date : 2015-04-11 Location : Des Moines, Iowa
Subject: Re: Pittsburgh Steelers 2022 Mock Drafts Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:43 am
Great Randino wrote:
Master_Of_Puppets wrote:
Great Randino wrote:
I reserve the right to like a player even if he's never a superstar.
Malik Willis - above average QB at a smaller division school who should be a running back. Someone will make the mistake of drafting him, I just hope it isn't us.
sure he will get drafted and should be. just not in the first round, and not by a team that needs an immediate starter. jalen hurts went in the 2nd at pick 53. i like willis coming out of college more than i did hurts. he has more arm talent than hurts. the guy needs a QB coach and a few years of film study..polish this guy up and you might end up with russell wilson. this guy has the same bag of tools wilson has, except between the ears. wilson in college knew when to move out of the pocket. when to tuck it and run when to throw it away. he didnt panic under pressure. wilson was also a 3rd round pick. teams thought he was too short ...
I actually meant someone will draft him "high". I figured people could probably figure that out though.
Russell Wilson threw 4 interceptions his entire senior year - playing in the Big Ten. His draft status (going in round 3) was because of his height. I'd personally have no problem with a shorter QB.
Willis is already way above 4 Int's - playing at a lower level.
Drafting a QB who is "athletic", and/or "Has a powerful arm", and hoping he develops into a pro QB is a mistake many teams have made through the years. While some do develop, most do not (DeShone Kizer anyone?).
No - he doesn't "have the same tools" as Russell Wilson.
A lot of people didn't believe Josh Allen was going to be good coming out of college. Allen played at Wyoming, which isn't exactly a powerhouse, and put up decent stats as a junior when he had his star receivers. His senior season he lost those guys and wasn't nearly as good as a result. Often times a QB is only as good as the talent that surrounds him. A lot of people said Allen was a project, and that he'd never be good at the NFL level but if you watched his game film closely you could see he had the talent.
Not saying Malik Willis is the next coming, but he could very well come into the NFL and be pretty damned good with the right talent around him, coupled with his athletic abilities. I wouldn't write the young man off simply because he's thrown some picks this season, he doesn't have elite talent surrounding him, and he plays at Liberty which is probably pretty close to playing at Wyoming as far as the overall talent on Liberty's roster and the types of recruits they pull in. Willis has 9 INTs on the year and a 1/3 of those came against the currently #10 ranked Ole Miss Rebels. I personally think with some coaching, and better talent to work with, Willis could have a shot to be a good NFL QB. Maybe I'm wrong, I'm just an Armchair Scout but I wasn't wrong about Josh Allen, so you never know.
_________________
"Success isn't owned, it's leased and the rent is due every day." - TJ Watt
I reserve the right to like a player even if he's never a superstar.
Malik Willis - above average QB at a smaller division school who should be a running back. Someone will make the mistake of drafting him, I just hope it isn't us.
sure he will get drafted and should be. just not in the first round, and not by a team that needs an immediate starter. jalen hurts went in the 2nd at pick 53. i like willis coming out of college more than i did hurts. he has more arm talent than hurts. the guy needs a QB coach and a few years of film study..polish this guy up and you might end up with russell wilson. this guy has the same bag of tools wilson has, except between the ears. wilson in college knew when to move out of the pocket. when to tuck it and run when to throw it away. he didnt panic under pressure. wilson was also a 3rd round pick. teams thought he was too short ...
I actually meant someone will draft him "high". I figured people could probably figure that out though.
Russell Wilson threw 4 interceptions his entire senior year - playing in the Big Ten. His draft status (going in round 3) was because of his height. I'd personally have no problem with a shorter QB.
Willis is already way above 4 Int's - playing at a lower level.
Drafting a QB who is "athletic", and/or "Has a powerful arm", and hoping he develops into a pro QB is a mistake many teams have made through the years. While some do develop, most do not (DeShone Kizer anyone?).
No - he doesn't "have the same tools" as Russell Wilson.
A lot of people didn't believe Josh Allen was going to be good coming out of college. Allen played at Wyoming, which isn't exactly a powerhouse, and put up decent stats as a junior when he had his star receivers. His senior season he lost those guys and wasn't nearly as good as a result. Often times a QB is only as good as the talent that surrounds him. A lot of people said Allen was a project, and that he'd never be good at the NFL level but if you watched his game film closely you could see he had the talent.
Not saying Malik Willis is the next coming, but he could very well come into the NFL and be pretty damned good with the right talent around him, coupled with his athletic abilities. I wouldn't write the young man off simply because he's thrown some picks this season, he doesn't have elite talent surrounding him, and he plays at Liberty which is probably pretty close to playing at Wyoming as far as the overall talent on Liberty's roster and the types of recruits they pull in. Willis has 9 INTs on the year and a 1/3 of those came against the currently #10 ranked Ole Miss Rebels. I personally think with some coaching, and better talent to work with, Willis could have a shot to be a good NFL QB. Maybe I'm wrong, I'm just an Armchair Scout but I wasn't wrong about Josh Allen, so you never know.
shaddup about allen already. i admitted you was right and i was wrong ...
well drafting a QB is like playing the lottery ...ya gotta play to win.
I reserve the right to like a player even if he's never a superstar.
Malik Willis - above average QB at a smaller division school who should be a running back. Someone will make the mistake of drafting him, I just hope it isn't us.
sure he will get drafted and should be. just not in the first round, and not by a team that needs an immediate starter. jalen hurts went in the 2nd at pick 53. i like willis coming out of college more than i did hurts. he has more arm talent than hurts. the guy needs a QB coach and a few years of film study..polish this guy up and you might end up with russell wilson. this guy has the same bag of tools wilson has, except between the ears. wilson in college knew when to move out of the pocket. when to tuck it and run when to throw it away. he didnt panic under pressure. wilson was also a 3rd round pick. teams thought he was too short ...
I actually meant someone will draft him "high". I figured people could probably figure that out though.
Russell Wilson threw 4 interceptions his entire senior year - playing in the Big Ten. His draft status (going in round 3) was because of his height. I'd personally have no problem with a shorter QB.
Willis is already way above 4 Int's - playing at a lower level.
Drafting a QB who is "athletic", and/or "Has a powerful arm", and hoping he develops into a pro QB is a mistake many teams have made through the years. While some do develop, most do not (DeShone Kizer anyone?).
No - he doesn't "have the same tools" as Russell Wilson.
A lot of people didn't believe Josh Allen was going to be good coming out of college. Allen played at Wyoming, which isn't exactly a powerhouse, and put up decent stats as a junior when he had his star receivers. His senior season he lost those guys and wasn't nearly as good as a result. Often times a QB is only as good as the talent that surrounds him. A lot of people said Allen was a project, and that he'd never be good at the NFL level but if you watched his game film closely you could see he had the talent.
Not saying Malik Willis is the next coming, but he could very well come into the NFL and be pretty damned good with the right talent around him, coupled with his athletic abilities. I wouldn't write the young man off simply because he's thrown some picks this season, he doesn't have elite talent surrounding him, and he plays at Liberty which is probably pretty close to playing at Wyoming as far as the overall talent on Liberty's roster and the types of recruits they pull in. Willis has 9 INTs on the year and a 1/3 of those came against the currently #10 ranked Ole Miss Rebels. I personally think with some coaching, and better talent to work with, Willis could have a shot to be a good NFL QB. Maybe I'm wrong, I'm just an Armchair Scout but I wasn't wrong about Josh Allen, so you never know.
shaddup about allen already. i admitted you was right and i was wrong ...
well drafting a QB is like playing the lottery ...ya gotta play to win.
...but like the lotto, your odds aren't real good!
...but like the lotto, your odds aren't real good!
how much of it do you think has to do with NFL coaching ? there are only 32 NFL teams. there are way way more college teams. why is it so many college teams every year can fill their QB position with a good to great QB , but so few of them can live up to their college level of play in the NFL. of course the level of competition is greater because the best of the best tend to be bigger stronger and faster. but how much of it is coaching ? the nfl trying to pound round players in to square holes. meaning the players are forced in to a system they are unfamiliar with and asked to do things other than what they did in college that made them good college players. every year we here the phrases referencing college teams or players like , pro style offense or doesnt translate to the pro's . so why does the NFL run offensive schemes and philosophies so different than what college teams do ? i mean its like buying a foreign car knowing you are going to have problems sourcing parts or finding a mechanic who has the knowledge to work on it. why doesnt the NFL adapt to the system they source their players from , instead of trying to force the players to adapt to their system. i we do get a slow drip of college offensive playbooks from time to time , like the wildcat and more recently RPO'S , but why not make it easier on yourself by changing what you do to what they did well in college. i would imagine that a college team that ran the option a lot , would look to recruit a high school QB that runs the option in high school. round player, round hole. a team that doesnt ever run the option but features a downfield passing attack, wouldnt have much interest in that option QB. that would be round player square hole .. someone please explain to me how my logic is wrong ?
shaddup about allen already. i admitted you was right and i was wrong ... 
